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The Colostomizer
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#341
01-03-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
Well then i guess it is just relative to the person. If you want me to prove the Muslim faith wrong, i'm not going to, nor do i know how. It's not up to me to tell you what to choose. This isn't my choice to make for you. Only you can make it. I can only present you with the information i believe to be true and you can either take it into consideration or you don't. Just know that according to my beliefs, God had a Son and that Son was His only Son. God loved us SOO much that He sacrificed His ONLY Son to die for us. That is some insane love right there.
I'm trying to show why people are wrong for making this kind of choice. There's no good reason to choose Christianity over Islam or vice-versa.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
Now from the Muslim point of view. Jesus was a great Prophet, yet He wasn't the Son of God. So when Jesus was killed upon the Cross, what then? According to the Muslim faith he was merely sentanced to death. Nothing more. He didn't want to die on the cross, he was put there for His "crimes". Did He still take on all the sins of the world to give us a chance for eternal life? How was Jesus connected to God if they weren't related? If you believe that according to the Christian faith no one is worthy of glorification then you'd know that without Jesus dying FOR OUR SINS we would have no chance of entering heaven. I know you don't believe what i as a Christian do but it's the idea that counts.
You're telling me that Muslims are wrong because you have faith that they're wrong, and Muslims are telling me the same thing. Who should I believe? You? Why?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
I'm not trying to bash the Muslim faith i'm just trying to point out the difference and explain it a little. Muslims believe alot of what i do about Christianity.
Once again, I don't need the differences explained to me. I already know the differences. I want to know why I should believe you over Muslims. Why are you justified and Muslims aren't? You can't answer that by telling me the differences.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
I am not about to abandon my faith just because people come along and tell me that there isn't enough proof to believe what i believe. It's gonna take a heck of alot more than that. I can honestly say that if one belief was proven to a great extent to be true and it happened not to be mine, i would consider. But i'm a devote Christian who loves the Lord Jesus Christ and God. I am not going to abandon them because they haven't abandoned me.
Think of it this way: my primary concern is for you to be open minded. My desire for you to abandon your faith is secondary to that. Your open mindedness is most important because I think that if you were to accomplish it, everything else would fall into place and you'd drop your Christian beliefs not because I told you there wasn't enough proof, but because you'd no longer think they were right. Do you think it's possible that you could ever change your mind and decide that accepting Christianity was wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colostomizer
What I mean is that there's no proof or even evidence to back up Christianity's claims.
Nor is there for any other belief.
That's why accepting Christianity or any other belief is wrong. That's why I'm agnostic.
The Colostomizer
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#342
01-03-2006
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Were you planning on having responsible sex?
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#343
01-03-2006
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Originally Posted by The Colostomizer
That's why accepting Christianity or any other belief is wrong. That's why I'm agnostic.
So what are you waiting for? Are you waiting for a belief, religion, faith, whatever to come up and bite you in the face? Sorry to be a little extreme but to me it's like you are waiting on something that's never going to happen. You must choose to believe in something. That is what i believe. Nothing is going to make the choice for you.
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#344
01-03-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
So what are you waiting for? Are you waiting for a belief, religion, faith, whatever to come up and bite you in the face? Sorry to be a little extreme but to me it's like you are waiting on something that's never going to happen. You must choose to believe in something. That is what i believe. Nothing is going to make the choice for you.
In a manner of speaking, yes. And you're right; it's probably not going to happen. I can deal with that.

Why must I choose to believe in something? Agnostics can lead lives that they consider to be meaningful. Should I choose to believe in something even if I'm not sure that it's right?
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#345
01-03-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colostomizer
You're telling me that Muslims are wrong because you have faith that they're wrong, and Muslims are telling me the same thing. Who should I believe? You? Why?
Again, it's not my place to tell you what to believe. You believe what you will. I can't prove to you that my faith is any more right than the Muslim faith. But if you say you are open minded, be open minded to what God has to say. I know you don't believe He exist (i think you don't), but just "pretend" He does. And I believe He will guide and direct you. That's all i can suggest. Be open to what God has to say. Let Him speak to you. Pray to Him. Ask Him to reveal THE Truth to you. Hard for YOU to do i know, but remember to keep an open mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colostomizer
In a manner of speaking, yes. And you're right; it's probably not going to happen. I can deal with that.

Why must I choose to believe in something? Agnostics can lead lives that they consider to be meaningful. Should I choose to believe in something even if I'm not sure that it's right?
I'm going to give you a reason to believe in at least SOMETHING. This is a HORRIBLE road to take but for you and what you believe, it's the only option. You can either sit and wait for an answer that will never present itself to you, only to find it when you die and by then it's too late. Or you can choose a belief now and at least STAND A CHANCE at being correct. If you're right about life after death, that there is nothing.... good for you. But if you are wrong, you've got everything to lose. If you've chosen a faith that doubles your chances to be right in the sense that there is an afterlife. That there is something more than just the lives we live here on Earth.

That's the best option i can provide for you.

Last edited by Vrbas; 01-03-2006 at 10:35 PM.
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#346
01-03-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
Again, it's not my place to tell you what to believe. You believe what you will. I can't prove to you that my faith is any more right than the Muslim faith. But if you say you are open minded, be open minded to what God has to say. I know you don't believe He exist (i think you do), but just "pretend" He does. And I believe He will guide and direct you. That's all i can suggest. Be open to what God has to say. Let Him speak to you. Pray to Him. Ask Him to reveal THE Truth to you. Hard for YOU to do i know, but remember to keep an open mind.
Even when I was a Christian, I never felt God's presence in my life. Not when I was sincerely praying, not when I was having deep discussions with my youth group, not in church, not when I was going through rough times, never. If God had something to say to me, it seems like he would have said it then, before I lost my faith, or at least when I lost my faith. Since I lost my faith, I've made an honest effort to remain open minded, and I'm pretty sure I've succeeded. God has remained quiet. I will continue to be open minded, but I don't expect God to come knocking any time soon.

I think that there is probably a creator (or maybe creators), but I'm pretty sure that Christianity is wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
I'm going to give you a reason to believe in at least SOMETHING. This is a HORRIBLE road to take but for you and what you believe, it's the only option. You can either sit and wait for an answer that will never present itself to you, only to find it when you die and by then it's too late. Or you can choose a belief now and at least STAND A CHANCE at being correct. If you're right about life after death, that there is nothing.... good for you. But if you are wrong, you've got everything to lose. If you've chosen a faith that doubles your chances to be right in the sense that there is an afterlife. That there is something more than just the lives we live here on Earth.

That's the best option i can provide for you.
Alright, so I should choose a belief so that I'll have a better chance of not being punished in the afterlife. (I think it's most likely that I won't be punished for not choosing a religion, so I'm not too worried about it, but I'll play along for a second.) Well, which religion should I pick? Should I flip a coin? That's the only solution I can think of, because I've never heard of a good reason to choose any one religion over the rest. Do you think I'm capable of sincerely believing in a religion that I picked by flipping a coin? Well, I'm not. If I'm going to pick a religion, I'm going to have to have a good reason for it. It can't be that one makes the most sense to me; they all seemingly contain inconsistencies and irrationalities. I'm going to have to wait until I find a good reason to pick a religion. (Also, I'm pretty sure you can't quantify the increase of my chances of being right for choosing a certain religion.)

Let's get something straight. I find it very unlikely that there is nothing after death. If there was nothing after death, I'd be wrong because I figure there probably is something after death.
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#347
01-03-2006
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Lets get to this post, Premarital Sex. You want a christians reasons why it's wrong?.. Well you got some right here.

Premarital sex = possible problems = unwanted Teen Pregnancies, transmitted diseases, family problems, financial problems, possible aboritons, paying child support which leads to more problems, not graduating from high school, not going to college, becoming a drug addict due to depression of having kid or alcoholic, many things could happen. And those chances are alot more likely to happen if you have premarital sex. The lord is the A and the Z, the begginning and the end, he knows everything. And he knows what can happen to people who have sex before marriage. That's why the lord says it's wrong. Look at todays world.. look at all the problems premarital sex has brought to the lives to the children of those who had premarital sex. Lastly, wouldn't you rather marry someone who hasn't had sex with someone else? Im posting my thoughts becasuse the starter of this post said it's aimed toward Christians so im standing up for my beliefs.
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#348
01-03-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrbas
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colostomizer
Even when I was a Christian, I never felt God's presence in my life. Not when I was sincerely praying, not when I was having deep discussions with my youth group, not in church, not when I was going through rough times, never. If God had something to say to me, it seems like he would have said it then, before I lost my faith, or at least when I lost my faith. Since I lost my faith, I've made an honest effort to remain open minded, and I'm pretty sure I've succeeded. God has remained quiet. I will continue to be open minded, but I don't expect God to come knocking any time soon.

I think that there is probably a creator (or maybe creators), but I'm pretty sure that Christianity is wrong.
I don't believe you ever were a true believer. I've explained why i think this before and i'm sure you remember. Once God's, always God's. Once you are His, you can not leave NOR do you want to leave. I believe you were where i was at an early point of my youth. You thought you were a Christian but turns out you had it all wrong in what you believed, that you missed something. I just find it impossible for someone who has experienced God's Grace and His unfailing love to ever want to turn away from it. It's like YOU KNOW when you've found what you are looking for.

About God revealing Himself to you, it's all about patience man. Patience is a virtue, God wants you to be patient. God doesn't reveal Himself to you when YOU want Him to, He does it on His own time and everything He does is according to His plan. He knows best. That's what i believe.
Before I became agnostic, I believed that God existed. I had faith that the Bible was right. I accepted that Jesus died for me. I genuinely believed. If someone had asked me whether or not I was Christian, I would have said yes and I would have meant it. Either you think I'm lying, or you don't think this constitutes being Christian. Which is it? Just because you don't want to turn from God now that you've accepted Him doesn't mean that it's impossible. "Once you are His, you can not leave NOR do you want to leave." That's the freakin' problem with Christianity, and it applies to most Christians. Religion is probably the most difficult thing to give up because it tells you that there's no chance that it's wrong. Once you believe that, what reason could you possibly have for turning away from God? It's difficult, but not impossible. When I accepted Christ, my mind did not completely close. That's why I was able to drop Christianity after having been a sincere believer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaS
Lets get to this post, Premarital Sex. You want a christians reasons why it's wrong?.. Well you got some right here.

Premarital sex = possible problems = unwanted Teen Pregnancies, transmitted diseases, family problems, financial problems, possible aboritons, paying child support which leads to more problems, not graduating from high school, not going to college, becoming a drug addict due to depression of having kid or alcoholic, many things could happen. And those chances are alot more likely to happen if you have premarital sex. The lord is the A and the Z, the begginning and the end, he knows everything. And he knows what can happen to people who have sex before marriage. That's why the lord says it's wrong. Look at todays world.. look at all the problems premarital sex has brought to the lives to the children of those who had premarital sex. Lastly, wouldn't you rather marry someone who hasn't had sex with someone else? Im posting my thoughts becasuse the starter of this post said it's aimed toward Christians so im standing up for my beliefs.
Premarital sex only causes problems when it's had in an irresponsible manner. The risks of unwanted pregnancy and STDs can be completely eliminated. You should have read into the thread a little bit. You would've seen that your point has already been refuted many times. I'd honestly rather marry a girl who's already had sex, because then she knows what she's doing. I don't want to get married to a girl who has no experience whatsoever.
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#349
01-04-2006
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Colost, (yes I came back, but only to ask this one question)

What are your veiws on following no Religion, but believing in God, and following the ten commandments?

PLus, I think you just dont WANT to feel Gods presense.
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#350
01-04-2006
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I'm breaking that rule I'm just going to use some rpinciples from the religion to add to my own, that's why I read about religions if I really want to, is to see if I agree with something that has moral value and live by some of its rules, After I read about LeVry's Satanism or something like that in the thread, I agree with some of the rules.

I use some of the Ten Commandments, The Buddhist meditating and Realizing life is suffering and to give up all your wants, I consider sex a need. All of the LeVry commandments exlcuding being wrathful. I just treat others as they do me, I don't want payback and I don't want to torture them, I supress those feeling



 

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