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T r i a D
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#121
09-22-2006
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I would like to quote something my mom said to me the other day:

"I will always love you no matter what, but it is not ME who will burn in hell forever."

I guess I have but one choice...

Why did god make me if he knew I would soon become an atheist?





Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed Lemon
Just because he's "omnipotent" doesn't mean he's high-and-mighty

Think for yourself.
Question authority.
Bill
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#122
09-22-2006
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I think someone said it earlier that God wouldn't want to show himself because then people would have to either love or fear him. That's why he doesn't show himself, so that we can make our own decision in loving him. So, if that's true why doesn't the Devil show himself. IDK is he trapped in hell I haven't read the bible yet.
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#123
09-22-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill
I think someone said it earlier that God wouldn't want to show himself because then people would have to either love or fear him. That's why he doesn't show himself, so that we can make our own decision in loving him. So, if that's true why doesn't the Devil show himself. IDK is he trapped in hell I haven't read the bible yet.
As far as this goes, that's basically the jist. If God showed himself, no faith would be required.

Pretentious- Everyone gets a chance to believe. It's your opportunity to take it. Maybe you shouldn't reserve yourself to being an athiest just yet.

But to actually answer your question, I'm not sure why God creates people who wont follow him. In the Bible it says it's their choice, but relative to God it doesn't seem to be.
Thank you.




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#124
09-22-2006
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Interesting thread. God does know everything but we dont. We dont know the choices we going to make in the future. Or what we will be faced with. If God did not give us free will we would not have the ability or could even fathom the word choice.
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#125
09-22-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by llcontrall
Interesting thread. God does know everything but we dont. We dont know the choices we going to make in the future. Or what we will be faced with. If God did not give us free will we would not have the ability or could even fathom the word choice.
Alright contra, here's the deal we've basically figured out.

From our human, limited perspective, it really seems like we have free will. We choose what to eat, where to live, who to marry, what football team to root for, what to type on the internet, etc.

However, all of this fits into God's master plan. He knows all of our actions before hand.

The characters in the book don't know what's going to happen, but the author does.
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#126
09-22-2006
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I just wanna throw out a random procesion of ideas. Random in that that makes it sound cooler.

For the most part, we like to view the universe as a physical thing that exists as we think it does. Of course, it's much weirder than that. Looking at it from a religious point of view (in this case, my own), it makes sense that G_d is the only thing that actually exists. All of reality as we know it is no more real than G_d chooses it to be. I'm a believer in constant creation. I believe that if G_d were to 'forget' about the universe, it would cease to exist, as an imagined image does in you mind.

As I've said before, this is in conflict with our own existance, or, more precisely, my own. I know that I exist. I also know that in knowing that I exist that I am self aware, and capable of making choices, or atleast get the illusion that I am thinking and making choices. If I am nothing more than an imagined thing, it wouldn't make much intuitive sense for me to be self aware. Not that intuition is to be trusted...

Now it's time for some creative parelels that compare two unlike things. In a dream, you are (or atleast some of the time) unaware of who you are when you are awake. You're in a place of your brain's creation. You're the only thing that exists outside of the dream. Your decisions in the dream, if you aren't aware of the fact that you're dreaming, seem to come from your subconscious, habit, memory associations, etc. Your decision making abilities are pulled from your brain.

Similarly, for us to have free will, it would need to be derived from the only real thing: G_d. Following that, you could say that we are like infinitely small partitions of G_d. Now, what would that imply? It could set up something very similar to the transcendentalist concept of an Over Soul. It could also branch into all sorts of Matrix-esque things. G_d can bend the spoon, because, when it boils down to it, there is no spoon, only the appearance of a spoon.

Sorry if it's abnormally hard to follow. It's 12:35AM, and I have been in need of a nap all day...
Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night.
Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm the rest of his life.

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#127
09-23-2006
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If god truly does exists as the christians portray him/it, than he/it is responsible for all the evil in this world, and itself, is inherently evil.
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#128
09-23-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooMuchButtHair
If god truly does exists as the christians portray him/it, than he/it is responsible for all the evil in this world, and itself, is inherently evil.
If God exists as Christianity portrays him, it is impossible for him to be evil.

If god exists the way you wish he did, he would be evil, so you could have an excuse not to believe.
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#129
09-23-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lammie
If God exists as Christianity portrays him, it is impossible for him to be evil.

If god exists the way you wish he did, he would be evil, so you could have an excuse not to believe.
Having the ability to effortlessly end the suffering of billions, and not use it, is evil. Creating a being, knowing that it was going to spend an eternity in hell is evil.
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#130
09-23-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooMuchButtHair
Having the ability to effortlessly end the suffering of billions, and not use it, is evil. Creating a being, knowing that it was going to spend an eternity in hell is evil.
Evil in your mind.

I suppose in your reality, your perspective is the only one that matters. I respect that. That's how I live, that's how almost everyone lives.

It is obviously part of his plan. You and I, being mortals, aren't able to interpret his plan the same way he can. We do not have the sovereign knowlegde of every situation that he does.
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