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NG
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#11
11-05-2008
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Originally Posted by Charlii View Post
and I'm saying it's always been like this.
But the point is that it hasn't always been like this.
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#12
11-05-2008
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Originally Posted by Charlii View Post
and I'm saying it's always been like this.
...and it was specifically stated so that it would not be like this.
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#13
11-15-2008
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Yeah I always think of that when I hear a president say something like 'god bless america'. if he wouldnt say that it would be the end of the world for modern day america but it was in no way what the so praised *founding fathers* intended.
it's a strange country, not saying bad or good.. just very strange.


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#14
12-17-2008
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i believe that america had 2 hav God in it somwhere i mean we r the most successful nation in the world and in like the last 8 or 9 years wen ppl hav jst tried 2 take God out of America look wat has happened we r going down the drain and it will only get worse...If they take God out of America then idk if america burns
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#15
12-17-2008
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Originally Posted by B 2tha R0ck View Post
i believe that america had 2 hav God in it somwhere i mean we r the most successful nation in the world and in like the last 8 or 9 years wen ppl hav jst tried 2 take God out of America look wat has happened we r going down the drain and it will only get worse...If they take God out of America then idk if america burns
America was a secular nation before the 1950s (that's when they added God in the Pledge and "in God we trust" to our coins) Did you know that God isn't even mentioned in the Constitution one time?
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#16
12-17-2008
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Originally Posted by B 2tha R0ck View Post
i believe that america had 2 hav God in it somwhere i mean we r the most successful nation in the world and in like the last 8 or 9 years wen ppl hav jst tried 2 take God out of America look wat has happened we r going down the drain and it will only get worse...If they take God out of America then idk if america burns
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#17
12-17-2008
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Originally Posted by Prowl View Post
Did you know that God isn't even mentioned in the Constitution one time?
God is however, mentioned in the Declaration of Independence--a document that started the "United States of America"--the first in fact, that that phrase was used to describe the nation as sovereign.

The Preamble:

"When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation."

Also it's used here--not the word "God", but it is used to refer to a divine being (perhaps one of the most famous lines in the charter):

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

The people who landed at Plymouth rock, the first settlers--they were what history calls Puritans. A Puritan by definition was an associate of any number of religious groups advocating for more "purity" in worship and doctrine as well as personal and group piety. Puritans felt that the English reformation had not gone far enough and that the Church of England of practices which they associated with the Church of Rome. In England, Puritans were seen as extremists and persecuted. They fled to the "New World" to be liberated from religious tyranny. So, one could argue that the nation was not necessarily founded on religion in itself, but instead religious tolerance (albeit the Puritans weren't so tolerant of those in their own communities who rejected Puritanism). "Religous freedom" is a phrase that is very prevalent in history as one of the pillars of liberty in the U.S. It is a country where you can believe in a single, true and living God, believe that there is no such thing, or believe that a science-fiction novel holds the key to the meaning of the universe.

According to The Association of Religion Data Archives, 82% of the U.S. claims Christianity as a religion, while only 11.31% are non-religious (the rest are catagorized as Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, and other). So for all of you who complain about God being in the Pledge of Allegiance and the words "In God We Trust" on our currency, I apologize--but you're outnumbered. I doubt very seriously that any of that will change in the near future.

So you can't just take one line from one treaty, in a time where political pressures and context played a huge role in what aforementioned treaty said no less, and say that THAT was the "true American belief/foundation". Centuries of religiosity and Christianity tell another tale my friend.
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#18
12-17-2008
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Originally Posted by Virtuoso View Post
God is however, mentioned in the Declaration of Independence--a document that started the "United States of America"--the first in fact, that that phrase was used to describe the nation as sovereign.

The Preamble:

"When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation."

Also it's used here--not the word "God", but it is used to refer to a divine being (perhaps one of the most famous lines in the charter):

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

The people who landed at Plymouth rock, the first settlers--they were what history calls Puritans. A Puritan by definition was an associate of any number of religious groups advocating for more "purity" in worship and doctrine as well as personal and group piety. Puritans felt that the English reformation had not gone far enough and that the Church of England of practices which they associated with the Church of Rome. In England, Puritans were seen as extremists and persecuted. They fled to the "New World" to be liberated from religious tyranny. So, one could argue that the nation was not necessarily founded on religion in itself, but instead religious tolerance (albeit the Puritans weren't so tolerant of those in their own communities who rejected Puritanism). "Religous freedom" is a phrase that is very prevalent in history as one of the pillars of liberty in the U.S. It is a country where you can believe in a single, true and living God, believe that there is no such thing, or believe that a science-fiction novel holds the key to the meaning of the universe.

According to The Association of Religion Data Archives, 82% of the U.S. claims Christianity as a religion, while only 11.31% are non-religious (the rest are catagorized as Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, and other). So for all of you who complain about God being in the Pledge of Allegiance and the words "In God We Trust" on our currency, I apologize--but you're outnumbered. I doubt very seriously that any of that will change in the near future.

So you can't just take one line from one treaty, in a time where political pressures and context played a huge role in what aforementioned treaty said no less, and say that THAT was the "true American belief/foundation". Centuries of religiosity and Christianity tell another tale my friend.
The thing is though, is that the Declaration of Independence is not American law. The Constitution however, which is our law, says that American law should be secular (i.e. separation of church and state).
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#19
12-17-2008
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Protestants were persecuted in Europe
Protestants move to our continent
Protestants found country.
"I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me"
Philippians 4:13

I will sacrifice to achieve

No one can limit my success

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#20
12-17-2008
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Originally Posted by Uhh Negative View Post
Protestants found country.
Under the belief that politics and religion should be separate.
 

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